Seen this? http://www.themercury.com.au/lifestyle/backer-pushes-pipes-route/story-fnj64o6u-1226815381186

"PROPONENTS of a Mt Wellington cable car are considering a route across the face of the Organ Pipes.

Mt Wellington Cableway Company executive director Adrian Bold said taking the cable car as close as possible to the iconic rock structure could be the best option.


Thoughts?

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15 Comments

  1. dave james

    unsurprising. .. it sucks balls. . Who are you Samps? 

  2. Samps AUTHOR

    Just a bloke who likes climbing mountains. And yes, it does suck Wondered if I was only person who had noticed article

  3. dave james

    most climbers  I have talked to haven't noticed the social media juggernaut of the developers. With the incoming Liberal Gov the developers will have their way and plonk the summit terminus  in a location that in a direct line with their preferred starting terminal would run the  cablecar straight over the columns. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=617130878323675&set=a.617130571657039.1073741829.148205918549509&type=1&theater

    And despite his claims to be considering several options- why would they put it anywhere else?. it would make the ride less dull to run it over the Pipes. Claims to be considering several options is a classic strategy to give the impression of flexibility, of negotiation and then (after public consultation on his own facebook page of supporters) claim that it is just what the people want. which is another classic way to make people accept something- make them feel like they own it, its theirs, or they got to choose it them selves.

    Don't get me entirely wrong, some climbers may like the idea of a cablecar for whatever reason, and even i can see some pros. it just doesn't check out when all values and principles are taken into account, in my opinion.

  4. Doug Bruce

    I'm with you 100%, Dave. And unfortunately it seems - as you say - that most (younger?) climbers are oblivious to the juggernaut. I did make a comment in response to the online article. Tony McKenny has circularised a number of climbers asking for feedback and whether the Climbers Club of Tasmania should have a collective stance. Maybe we should conduct a poll on thesarvo ...

  5. Tony McKenny

    My take is that I am not anti Cable Car per se – think it is a silly idea and inappropriate but hey,  I have used them and climbed near them in many places round the world.

    BUT I do have some issues I personally think we should be concerned about, not least that we should try to ensure that:

    1. The proposal doesn’t restrict or change access via the road to the bottom or top of the Pipes in any way

    2. Any infrastructure doesn’t involve blasting, altering, changing the Pipes – the last version from some years ago involved blasting off the top of the Columns and erecting a pylon as I recall. Presumably there would be a cut swathe right up the mountain underneath the line of the cables, as with other similar facilities at ski resorts , which would be VERY visible from Hobart

    3. It doesn’t restrict access to climbing e.g. underneath the line of the cable car, or endanger climbers in any way e.g. stuff thrown out of the cable car

    4. The values of mountain users are respected. The latest diatribe from the proponents mentions having the proposed route be as close to actual cliff face as possible: maybe they don’t know of the long history of climbers, over 50 years now, on the mountain : do they realise that climbers from around the world visit Hobart to climb there I wonder?  It is a unique climbing environment, a bush/mountain setting so close to the City etc etc

    5. Existing commercial operators opinions and commercial needs are respected – climbing guides, mountain bike guiding companies, coach /bus companies walking tours  - possibly they are ignoring that dialogue or maybe just unaware the mountain is already a major economic drawcard and an important cog in the economy of Hobart, and the state.....

    6. A personal note: we, the tax payers, don’t end up subsidising it!!! At all – EVER!  How would they ensure this?

     

  6. Domhnall Brannigan

    A succinct summary of how I feel too, Tony. Thanks.

  7. Cameron McKenzie

    Well said Tony,

    Environmental  issues aside, I think that the biggest issues are that access via the road is not changed, and that the cable car is not subsidised. I don't see how it can possibly be viable unless they close the road and force everyone to catch the cable car up the hill. This would be an unacceptable situation for anyone who does anything on the mountain other than go to the top and come down again.

    Cam

  8. Doug Bruce

    Is this what we're headed for ...

     

     

     

     

  9. dave james

    the developers have been very clear they don't want any change to access via the road all though they have been clear to suggest they think its a waste that people use it without paying anything (a suggestion i find insulting).

    Quite cleverly the developers don't need to have the road closed. Very likely the incoming Liberal government with a hardline economic rationalist bent will push for a toll or parks pass style arrangement for using the road (" nothing to do with cable car...just a coincidence"). I'm guessing the Libs would even make the cablecar a project of state significance which would  allow public resources to be directed to it. Of course the  developers claim  they don't need any public money  but they wouldn't complain if the terminal site was prepared for them or if a cheap lease arrangement was made etc etc or even if a toll or parks pass was needed to use the road otherwise.

    They have also been claiming consistently that only minimal clearing will be required, with the gondolas or whatever they are, suspended above the trees. I'm guessing if it goes over the pipes they will need a tower at the top of the pipes. 

     The downhill mountainbiking community is very supportive of the project as they don't like riding uphill (bikes not designed for it). Currently these users put their bikes in a vehicle drive up to the springs and all but one ride down with the other driving thevehicle down, then they do it again swapping the driver and again, and again. Witha cable car they don't need a vehicle to drive up at all and not one of their mates has to miss a single run down.

    You can be sure that within  a matter of days adrian bold will be monitoring this thread  and preparing himself.

    Tasmania is an amazing place because it is undeveloped. The more we make it the same as the rest of the world, the more average it becomes. ho hum.

     

  10. Simon Young

    I have nothing against the Cable Car on grounds of aesthetics etc. Having seen many around the world, climbed from them and under them they never once detracted from my personal experience. Often they increased it. How would the sight of the cable car compare to the sight of either one of the transmission towers, the square lookout or even 'Ogilvie's Scar' (the road). You wont see the cable, struggle to make out cars so its the pylons that are the visual impact. The station at the top will be great, I'd love a beer after a climb. How many tourists would have a meal at the restaurant? Every single one. Just don't build a square box and all that will be seen are lights, again no different to the lights of cars driving really. Calling the front of the organ pipes some dreamy wild escape seems far fetched to me. "As i walk under the powerlines from the carpark, along the metre wide trail(that i love btw), casting my gaze at the multitudes on Flange Buttress, listening to a motorbike on the road, i gaze out to the zinc-works and wonder what all those 200,000 people in front of me are up to". I know the boat that comes in at 11:30am most days on the Totem Pole, honking its horn, has not ruined that experience for me. Yes we do need to keep some places wild, and beware the dangerous creep!

    I do have a problem with how commercially viable it is. I saw on their website once an amazing looking top station, covered in snow that you could ski from. Now THAT is something i'd be excited about. But if thats their grasp on reality, that they think they'll make a fortune in winter from snow-goers well thats just insane. I've seen numbers crunched by them to try and prove its viability but i think they're kidding themselves.  The last thing this state needs is another commercial burden. If wishes were horses, the cable car would ride...

    So yes they probably will have to close the roads as you guys mention. Trés uncool.  

    1. Tony McKenny

      A couple of thoughts.

      One is that the visual impact when viewed from Hobart may/will probably be much more than they are showing in their photo-shopped publicity stuff. Most of the projected line of the cable car looks like being in the tree zone, over tall forest - and it may mean that a wide swathe will need to be cut through that  vertically  all the way to the base of the  Pipes - and kept open for access to the lines and towers and to minimise bush fire damage etc, a permanent and very visible line up the  Mountain. We can but hope not but it needs to be watched.

      Which raises the second point, alluded to by Simon.  Their publicity stuff so far is blatantly pie in the sky, designed to sway "hearts and minds" - and it is very seductive - skiing on Mt Wellington, what fun.  But I reckon  we as climbers need to be thoughtful about the implications in their publicity statements for us and not take anything at face value.  The devil is always in the fine print.

       

  11. Samps AUTHOR

    Some excellent points made by dave james
    Climbers are a legitimate stakeholder in this debate having a long history of climbing on Mt W

    Making our voices heard on this one as a community groups is up to us

  12. Jon Nermut

    There is a forum thingo today at 12.30pm:

    http://www.themercury.com.au/news/tasmania/all-invited-to-address-respect-the-mountain-forum-in-hobart/story-fnj4f7k1-1226837048490

    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Respect-the-Mountain-No-Cable-Car/443385422375996

  13. Tony McKenny

    Update on the Cable Car saga.

    Following on from comments on thesarvo and others made to members of the club committee, a brief letter was sent to the HCC aldermen outlining our concerns about the proposal as it at present stands.  The letter was sent in conjunction with the other two main climbers organisations down south viz the TCIA and the TUMC . 

    Two members of the Club subsequently attended the HCC meeting on Monday 28th April. They reported that:  “In essence the Council will not consider or comment until the matter of the boundary rezoning has been considered by the Wellington Trust. The Trust has not had an application as yet but if one is received the process takes about three months. The matter was firmly referred back to the Trust. The Council also stated that they will only consider applications that are consistent with the Wellington Plan.”

    To date, the proponents have not made an application and do not have a real concept plan or a business plan. So there is no need to panic at this stage but we should watch developments. The suggestion is that we look at a tactical plan which will enable us to respond to any issues that concern us quickly and effectively and to this end we are proposing to talk further with the TCIA and TUMC members  and committees.

    More later....

  14. dave james

    my guess is the current government will somehow rescind the powers of the wellington trust and relax planning restrictions.